The Legacy Kickoff Launcher had a clean initial view, where the desired *content* (such as Favorites, Places, History, etc) is positioned vertically, directly above the mouse cursor when clicking the launcher icon. This new launcher puts the content *away* from the cursor, which requires careful *diagonal* or *zig-zag* mouse movement, simply to click on a favorite app. --- A picture is worth a thousand words? Then a video is worth a million: VIDEO #1: Legacy method, cleaner, fewer mistakes, easy targets https://imgur.com/a/LN7uXUz --- VIDEO #2: New method, more cluttered, less intuitive, more mistakes, requires conscious effort https://imgur.com/a/iNH9yAF --- It doesn't matter if I switch from grid to list, the same issue applies. This is why users are still grabbing the Legacy Kickoff Launcher from the KDE Store (even though it's no longer being maintained.) Soon we might have no choice but to use this new launcher; not because we asked for it, but because we *have* to. --- I implore the devs to watch the linked videos and understand that "simpler is better" when it comes to quickly launching your favorite apps. Give us big, breathable targets within immediate reach that don't require zig-zags or careful diagonal movements. Don't make us consciously think about having to carefully aim with our cursor. Let us be able to hover using the bottom panels. Currently, too much movements are required, even with Places. Using this new launcher is like a mini-game. The Legacy Kickoff Launcher "stayed out of the way" and let us quickly launch apps and places. BIG, EASY TARGETS are preferable to always using *sub-menus* and *split views*. It should be the encouraged method. However, with this new launcher, we practically have to keep using sub-menus and arbitrary split views. CONTENT should be the priority, *not* CATEGORIES nor SUB-MENUS. Read the comments on the Legacy Kickoff Launcher in the KDE Store. You'll notice a theme.
The particular issue with inappropriate category switching was already fixed in Plasma 5.22. I would recommend that you have your users upgrade. :) Beyond that, if you prefer the design of the old menu you and your users are welcome to continue using it. Yet, it's not maintained anymore, but it was more or less feature complete and stable. For what it's worth, we have gotten a lot of positive reviews of the new interface, so it's not like it's some kind of universally despised thing that we replaced an old beloved thing with for literally no reason. :) The new design fixed many design issues with the old one. *** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of bug 434904 ***
(In reply to Nate Graham from comment #1) > The particular issue with inappropriate category switching was already fixed > in Plasma 5.22. I would recommend that you have your users upgrade. :) The videos I linked are from, Operating System: Manjaro Linux KDE Plasma Version: 5.22.5 KDE Frameworks Version: 5.86.0 Qt Version: 5.15.2 Kernel Version: 5.14.7-2-MANJARO (64-bit) Graphics Platform: X11 Processors: 8 × 11th Gen Intel® Core™ i7-1165G7 @ 2.80GHz Memory: 15.4 GiB of RAM Graphics Processor: Mesa Intel® Xe Graphics So I take it there's not going to be a way to have the content (e.g, favorite apps) be positioned above the cursor, and it's still going to require a diagonal movement and/or zig-zag to click on your favorite apps and places? The "angle" of trajectory seems to determine whether or not the categories will intercept the cursor. Again, this is an awkward balancing act for something that is used to quickly click a frequent/favorite app. If I move the cursor a bit *too* vertical, it will activate the categories. If I use an angle that's *too* horizontal, I always undershoot the target. What has been streamlined beyond the legacy method? I see nothing under the options to change the display or panels. I see no option to disable category triggering on hover. I see no option to enable hovering for the bottom panels. I see no difference in behaviour from previous versions of Plasma. I'm on Plasma 5.22.5 (same as the videos.)
Reading the "fix" at... https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-workspace/-/commit/36ca390f56115ae9cbb1423cd00976e8dffec4d9 ...only further proves my point. The new layout *is* the reason that such a "fix" is needed. The "TriangleMouseFilter" introduces more complexities to try and predict the user's intention based on the movement of their cursor. A launcher with an intuitive and CLEAN layout requires no such intelligent filters to try and mask a design flaw, as good as the intention is.
Your video #2 very clearly shows the exact bug that was fixed in Plasma 5.22, and we have no other reports of it being broken for people on 5.22. So the options are: - You don't actually have Plasma 5.22 - You have a local copy of an older version of the applet in ~/.local/share/plasma/plasmoids/ that is masking the system-provided applet - Manjaro has a packaging error that left you with the old applet or applied a faulty downstream patch Again, I'm sorry that you don't like the new menu. You're welcome to stick with the old one. It was hoped that the triangle filter would alleviate complaints about unintended category switching, and so far it has done so. I would recommend that you try it out (once you've gotten the fix) and see if you feel better about it. Our experience was that people requested all sorts of changes (Move the category list over to the right! Delete the category list! Let me disable hover and only change categories on click!) and as soon as the triangle filter was implemented, all the complaints disappeared as if by magic.
(In reply to Nate Graham from comment #4) > Again, I'm sorry that you don't like the new menu. You're welcome to stick > with the old one. Nate, I don't want to get too psychological or philosophical, but a lot of the time users go quiet is because of fatigue. It's not neccessarily a mandate of the users once they diffuse their complaints. Sometimes it's not worth it to be persistent in reporting bugs (or deliberate designs) and to just get used to the "new normal". Many will just take whatever little improvements they can get and be done with it. It's just not worth to keep making their arguments behind why something breaks the momentum in their PC usage. I was reluctant to even report this, and I almost did not, since I had a hunch what the response would be. Will I keep using KDE? Yes! Will I use the legacy launcher as long as possible? Yes! Will I switch to the new launcher once the old one breaks due to non-compatibility with a future iteration of Plasma? Yes! Will I voice another complaint about the new launcher, and implore the devs to incorporate optional settings. Not likely. I'll just have to accept it. Does that imply I am happier with the new launcher? No, but it can be mistaken as such. --- Do you see my friends and my cousin complaining about it? They use Linux as a desktop, as a means to an end. They don't even know what a bug report is! ;) (Hence, they don't "exist".) Yet even recently when I re-installed Manjaro for my cousin on his new laptop, one of the first things he said was "Dude what the heck" when he tried using the new launcher. He asked if I could put back "That Windows 7 menu like we had it before" (referring to the previous laptop we installed Manjaro on.) --- The "pool of users" gets smaller and smaller with every layer: * Those who use Linux... * ...of these who use KDE... * ...of these who have active accounts on bug trackers... * ...of these who are willing to make bug reports... * ...of these who are willing to follow through... --- For example, there were no reports of Smb4K freezing when using it normally. Not even for earlier versions, even up to version 3.1.0; yet this glaring usability bug existed. Finally I said "Oh heck! I'll report it, and I'll record a VIDEO of it happening." Lo' and behold, not long after posting the video, the lead developer of Smb4K pin-pointed the bug and fixed it in the next version. According to the concept of "I don't really hear many complaints about XYZ" then the bug never was an issue? How can we know that there weren't "silent users" of Smb4K who kept having to restart the app every time it froze and didn't think it was worth it to try to report the bug or capture it on video? What if I never reported the bug, does that mean everyone who uses Smb4K isn't really bothered by the random freezes? After all, they're not complaining about it, let alone not even vocal about it. --- I don't mean any of this facetiously, and as you might have guessed I *LOVE* KDE. I understand that written text can come off as offensive, so I apologize if you think I'm being aggressive or rude. I just try to word things in a way that highlights the salient points. Just something to consider when you think about user consensus and satisfaction.
(In reply to Nate Graham from comment #4) > - You don't actually have Plasma 5.22 I definitely do, unless "Info Center" and Pamac are lying about the version. (Latest stable updates from Manjaro) --- > - You have a local copy of an older version of the applet in > ~/.local/share/plasma/plasmoids/ that is masking the system-provided applet There's only one item in that directory, nothing else: org.kde.plasma.kickofflegacy --- > - Manjaro has a packaging error that left you with the old applet or applied > a faulty downstream patch That's not something I am familiar with. I assume that Manjaro's packages are mostly vanilla Arch Linux, and only patched if necessary. I don't see why they would patch the launcher specifically. (But who knows!)
Let's try to focus here. One issue is that the triangle filter isn't working for you. Another issue is that even if the filter was working, you think that the categories sidebar is located in the wrong place. Let's discuss these in different places. We can use this bug report for your design concern, and I'd like to ask you to open another one to track the issue of the triangle filter seemingly not working for you despite using Plasma 5.22. Please try to avoid too much editorializing in that bug report. :) I know you don't like the design, but let's discuss that in *this* bug report. It might be worth mentioning that in the Simple Menu widget--which was the inspiration for the new Kickoff design--the categories list was on the right side, not the left side. Probably to address your exact concern. We considered that during the initial design process, but ultimately decided against it because of how it would be inconsistent with other sidebars elsewhere in other user interfaces.
*** Bug 438553 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
*** Bug 443332 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
I came here from the duplicate bug. Triangle filter from 5.22 actually works for me, but it doesn't solve the problem that mouse cursor has to go extra-mile every time to reach the favorites list. In my everyday usage, in 90% of cases I open kickoff launcher only to use favorites list, so being forced to pass categories sidebar steals some time and takes away from usability. However, I totally understand the point that placing sidebar on the right side may confuse some users, as in all other system applications sidebars are usually located on the left side. But why not making sidebar location optional and configurable in one click, with being on the left side by default? I think it's the best solution which should satisfy everyone.
Apologies for going slightly off topic, but after reading through many of the reports regarding the new kickoff launcher, comment 5 above sums it up for me: I like and care for Plasma, but I'm not creating a new report. This thread looks like the closest place where someone might listen: To me the legacy kickoff is perfect, because there is consistency: right/left/up/down to navigate the menus, enter to activate. There are no dead ends, when you reach the last item next arrow wraps to start. Thus, to shut down: SUPER > LEFT > UP > ENTER To last item in favorite list: SUPER > UP > ENTER Because of this consistency I find the legacy kickoff launcher very intuitive and the best start menu I have ever used, be it Windows, Mac or any Linux. While the new is still good, it is a step down, because now: To shut down: SUPER > DOWN > RIGHT > RIGHT > SPACE (ENTER for some strange reason highlights first item in favorite list?) To last item in favorite list: SUPER > RIGHT > RIGHT > RIGHT > ENTER or SPACE It gets worse if you want to navigate categories by keyboard: To see Help Center: SUPER > LEFT > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > DOWN > SPACE (ENTER does nothing here). So dear devs: please do also look into keyboard navigation of the (new) launcher.
Any update on this bug? It seems that Kickoff launcher still doesn't provide an option to place categories on the right side.
Instead of trying to get the new launcher's devs to change it's behavior, layout etc. etc. (they obviously don't want to change anything about it) simply do what I did: Install Legacy Kickoff and you're done ( https://store.kde.org/p/1468103 ) :-P ;-)
It's not about requesting to change the launcher itself, it's about requesting new options and settings for it. Customizability is one the main principles behind the KDE software, so what's wrong about requesting more of it for a specific widget? I love the new Kickoff widget and it's design, but the sidebar placement causes inconveniences for me – it's not a reason to switch to the old legacy widget like you say, but def. the reason to request a single checkbox in widget settings to eliminate them.
(In reply to Tobias Leupold from comment #13) > Instead of trying to get the new launcher's devs to change it's behavior, > layout etc. etc. (they obviously don't want to change anything about it) > simply do what I did: Install Legacy Kickoff and you're done ( > https://store.kde.org/p/1468103 ) :-P ;-) This is what I did. Back then they designed a simple, practical, sleek launcher (now referred to as "Legacy" Kickoff), which works great. I still don't understand why they needed to replace it with this new launcher. It appears to be going backwards in usability and practicality, in which they actually need to add even more complexities to try and undo some of the inferior behaviors. (Smaller targets. Poor default presentation. "Triangle" filter to try and predict if the user wants to access her favorites or browse the categories. Etc. Etc. Etc.) Seriously, just watch the video I linked to in my original post. The only problem in regards to sticking with the Legacy Launcher is that it's no longer maintained, and might break compatibility with a future KDE release.
(In reply to Max from comment #14) > It's not about requesting to change the launcher itself, it's about > requesting new options and settings for it. Customizability is one the main > principles behind the KDE software, so what's wrong about requesting more of > it for a specific widget? > I love the new Kickoff widget and it's design, but the sidebar placement > causes inconveniences for me It's not JUST the poor placement of the favorite applications. It's not JUST that you cannot change what view is placed on the left side (i.e, near your mouse cursor's starting position.) Where is the option to "hover" over the bottom tabs? Even to this day, you must click on the tabs to navigate to the section. No option to hover. Speaking of the bottom tabs, the Legacy Launcher requires fewer steps and less navigation to get to frequently used actions. History? Hover over the History tab. I'm there. Places? Hover over the Computer tab. I'm there. Yet with this "new and improved" launcher... History? *Click* on Places. *Then*move up to hover over History. *Then* move (yet again) towards the right to access history entries. Rather than use all the available space for easily accessible hover tabs, they try to cram in as much as possible into this new launcher, and just leave it to the end-user to do acrobatics with their mouse cursor. Sorry, but the Legacy Launcher had a cleaner and more practical design. This same phenomenon is true for Windows as well. Windows 7 introduced one of the best and most practical Start Menus. They botched it in Windows 8, 10, and 11. So much so that there's a third-party open source alternative (named OpenShell) which basically lets you use the Windows 7 launcher on Windows 10. Developers just can't leave good things alone.
After a distro update gave me Plasma 5.26.5 yesterday the clunkiness of this new launcher is immediately apparent. To make it at all usable I placed it on the right side of the panel so that the mouse doesn't move over the categories list. I've been using KDE because it normally gives the user the ability to customize things easily, but this is a major fail. Surely implementing a right/left layout swap of the list should be trivial, but this has not been addressed in over a year. The Legacy Kickoff was a much better design for me as I used Favorites almost exclusively. The categories list is just wasted space and a navigation hazard. I truly wish Linux desktop developers took "not breaking things" as seriously as the kernel devs do.
Legacy Kickoff still works perfectly: https://store.kde.org/p/1468103
> a lot of the time users go quiet is because of fatigue. Indeed. This is why I stopped reporting systemd bugs, for example.
> It was hoped that the triangle filter would alleviate complaints about unintended category switching, > and so far it has done so. I'm afraid not. Here comes yet another complaint about unintended category switching, this time from a Plasma 5.27.5 user. I'm an imperfect human in a physical world, and as such, my mouse movements are not in perfect lines. When my pointer inevitably strays from the prescribed path on the way from launcher button to favorites list, this new launcher cruelly yanks my favorites out of view, replacing them with something unwanted and disorienting. This happens dozens of times per day, every day. A month of use has not made it easier. It feels like the UI is actively trying to defeat me. I'm baffled as to why someone would take a convenience tool like a favorites list, and move it out of easy reach, and furthermore place obstacles in the way. Is there a common use case for which this arrangement works well? If so, then it seems to me that an option to swap the favorites and categories positions would be an elegant compromise.
(In reply to Forest from comment #20) > > It was hoped that the triangle filter would alleviate complaints about unintended category switching, > > and so far it has done so. > > I'm afraid not. Here comes yet another complaint about unintended category > switching, this time from a Plasma 5.27.5 user. Here's another issue with this new launcher, even on the latest KDE release on vanilla Arch Linux: Even for the times you *WANT* to navigate to a category, you have to move your cursor in a way that doesn't trigger the "triangle filter", otherwise your "hover" will not be registered, and the category will not be selected! (I find I have to sometimes do a little horizontal "wiggle" with my cursor for it to select the category. I sure do love playing mind-games with my mouse cursor!) So now we're in a weird pickle: You have to be conscious about how you move your cursor to quickly reach a Favorite, or else you'll accidentally trigger a category... *BUT* ...ff you *WANT* to trigger a category, it might not work since the "triangle filter" may accidentally assume you want to reach a Favorite! Hooray! /s It's comical. The menu launcher is meant to be simple and sleek, without requiring any special consideration from the end-user, let alone an added layer of complexity with the "triangle filter". What's the solution to this? Fix the layout of the launcher? Add an option on which side to place the Favorites? Add an option on whether you should click or hover to activate a tab? Place the "Applications" tab on the bottom for more "breathable" access? (They already do this with the "Places" tab.) Nope! Let's figure out how to make the "triangle filter" even more intelligent to predict human behavior! There's no way we can concede that this new launcher's design is inferior to the Legacy Launcher. (As a side-note concern: I wouldn't be surprised if this eventually is fixed, yet it still remains frustrating to access your Favorites because there exists a "triangle filter" that will still try to predict your mouse movements and neglect to activate the item that is being hovered over).
I'm telling you. As I sit here using the "Legacy Launcher" it feels much more elegant and SNAPPY. The VERY moment I hover over an item or tab it is activated. (And this is good, because everything is isolated from each other: Favorites, Applications, Places, History, Session) It doesn't matter if I move the cursor perfectly vertical... or at a slight 87-degree angle, or with a slight skew, or in a "twitchy" zig-zag. Whatever my cursor is hovering over is "active", and I can click on it or navigate through it. This is true 100% of the time. No unintended targets or "filters" that ignore my mouse position. No fancy attempts to predict my movements. No need to play games with my cursor or do little "wiggles" to make sure I'm "over the target". I click on the Legacy Launcher and move my cursor up and down, as my favorite items are IMMEDIATELY registered the MOMENT I have over them. I click on the Legacy Launcher and move my cursor sideways, as the tab I want is IMMEDIATELY activated (such as "Applications" or "History".) Now in these separate sections, I don't need to worry about any collisions or accidental triggers. EVERYTHING is intuitive and snappy. This is not so with the new launcher. It feels "fidgety". Hovering your cursor over something doesn't always activate it. It "depends" how fast you're moving your cursor and at what angle... that's ridiculous. What other software has to try to "predict" the person's mouse movements, just to use its menus and buttons? That's such a poor way to design something. Imagine if you wrote a reply in this discussion, and tried to click "Save Changes", but it doesn't register because you moved your cursor "too vertically" to reach the button? (Because it predicted you wanted to navigate to something else?) I'm pleading with the devs here. Please just give KDE users a simple, intuitive launcher with easy targets and no ambiguity on its behavior. (The Legacy Launcher was practically perfect.)
Sadly, this discussion (I think it's not a "bug report" anymore) has reached the point where each post is a rant and the whole thing is trench warfare. In my opinion, Legacy Kickoff has way better design and usability, and is the way better start menu. I totally agree with the other cries of naysayers here. However, the folks developing the new launcher surely did their best and thought about what they implemented. I don't think it's meaningful to tinker the new thing until everybody is happy. This won't happen. The fact the the option to rearrange the layout wasn't implemented yet doesn't mean that the dev(s) can't do this, it means that he/she/they simply don't want to. I'm a (small) KDE dev myself. This whole discussion is annoying and unpleasant for everybody for sure. I also had to deal with dissatisfied users myself. It's not always easy. But we should keep it polite and professional. IMHO, the only viable solution is to eventually leave the decision to the user. Simply package Legacy Kickoff again and let the users choose the launcher they want. But show the choices. Inform the users that they CAN have another start menu. Most users will leave the default settings as-is. A lot of people are used to this from the Windows or macOS word. Don't like something? It's sink or swim. But we DO have the possibility to let the user decide. And that's what KDE is about: Give a reasonable default which is easy and convenient, but also give a choice for more advanced users. What do you think?
I agree with your point that KDE is all about choice, but the choice should not only be about using one start menu or another: the start menu itself should provide the choice and ability to configure it for user's liking, at least the most frequently requested options. You don't have to install whole another taskbar widget in order to get the ability to place it on the right side of your screen, right? Almost every thing in KDE interface has some options and configurations — in fact, there's so much of them, that I keep discovering new options and hidden features even after 6 years of using KDE. And yet, for whatever reason, devs decided to make an exception just for the new Kickoff launcher, implementing quite arguable UX decision and leaving no option to change it, with the argumentation like "get used to it or change the launcher". Just as you mentioned, it feels a lot like macOS, when "big company" forces you to accept their vision on how to use the computer, instead of allowing you to implement your vision. This is not what KDE is all about, in my opinion. Your "solution" about using the Legacy launcher doesn't fit for me, because I quite like the new launcher, I like the grid layout much more that a list one. Also it's the only launcher that will be actively maintained and get new features. But I don't like the left-side sidebar and hover activation — even the legacy launcher had an option to disable hover activation, despite it was less neccessary there.
Created attachment 160376 [details] draft: Kickoff from Plasma 5.27.5 with configurable sidebar position I feel strongly that this should be configurable, so I decided to take on the work of making it so. In case anyone wants to test it, here's a patched version of the Kickoff plasmoid from Plasma 5.27.5, patched with a new "sidebar position" option. To install, create a $HOME/.local/share/plasma/plasmoids/org.kde.plasma.kickofftest/ directory and place the contents of this archive in it. This will not interfere with your existing launcher. This new one is called "Application Launcher (test)", and you'll have to manually add it to your panel. I plan to submit patches for both Plasma 5.27 and Plasma on Gitlab soon.
*both Plasma 5.27 and Plasma 6.
(In reply to Forest from comment #25) > Created attachment 160376 [details] > draft: Kickoff from Plasma 5.27.5 with configurable sidebar position > > I feel strongly that this should be configurable, so I decided to take on > the work of making it so. > > In case anyone wants to test it, here's a patched version of the Kickoff > plasmoid from Plasma 5.27.5, patched with a new "sidebar position" option. Just tested it, and it works as you described! CAVEAT: In my opinion, the Legacy Launcher is still preferable, since it already has a sane layout and is much snappier to use. (For reasons already discussed by myself and a few others in this thread.) Even when I move the "Favorites" to the left side, the "Application Categories" (now on the right side) still suffers from the "Triangle Filter". So let's say I want to go to my "Internet" applications. If I move my mouse too fast or at the wrong angle, I'll accidentally end up going to "Office" or "Multimedia" applications. :/ (I'm telling you, this new launcher slows down my workflow and creates more problems than solutions. I hate being "conscious" about using a menu launcher.) This is not an issue with the Legacy Launcher, since it's layout is simpler and easier to navigate. There's no need for any fancy "Triangle Filter" or "predictions", since there's no risk of collisions or overlaps. (With the new launcher, it's such a pain to quickly open up a file from the "History"; while it's very easy and effortless to do so with the Legacy Launcher.) Being able to choose which side your Favorites are displayed is definitely an improvement for this new launcher. My appreciation to you! Ironically, it feels like we're just re-inventing the Legacy Launcher. :P (I'm still going to use the Legacy Launcher. I need to get work done, and I can't feel like my desktop is creating friction or resistance. I don't want to have to "think about" every time I use the launcher.) Cluttering more things into "sub-panes" makes this new launcher feel crammed, and more prone to collisions or accidents. The Legacy Launcher has large, distinct "tabs" to effortlessly switch between modes: Favorites, Applications, Places, History, Settings, Leave, etc. (You can even enable/disable the ones you want.) No fancy mouse movements needed. Nothing's "crammed" together. The new launcher crams "History" and "Places" together, but you need to navigate a "sub-pane" to switch between them, and only after visiting the "Places" section on the bottom. The same for "Favorites" and "Applications". There's just too much going on in a crammed space with this new launcher. It must also bear repeating: It's super annoying to have to consciously move my mouse cursor vertically AS STRAIGHT AS POSSIBLE so that it registers immediately what I hover over. If there's an "angle" or "skew" to my movement, it doesn't register the item. (Luckily, this doesn't happen with the "Favorites". It only affects the sub-panes that use a "Triangle Filter".)
(In reply to Forest from comment #25) > Created attachment 160376 [details] > draft: Kickoff from Plasma 5.27.5 with configurable sidebar position > > I feel strongly that this should be configurable, so I decided to take on > the work of making it so. > > In case anyone wants to test it, here's a patched version of the Kickoff > plasmoid from Plasma 5.27.5, patched with a new "sidebar position" option. > > To install, create a > $HOME/.local/share/plasma/plasmoids/org.kde.plasma.kickofftest/ directory > and place the contents of this archive in it. This will not interfere with > your existing launcher. This new one is called "Application Launcher > (test)", and you'll have to manually add it to your panel. > > I plan to submit patches for both Plasma 5.27 and Plasma on Gitlab soon. Thanks for your great work. I really hope you'll manage to get this to the patch, and that it won't get rejected by the team – as they appear to be quite protective of the whole left sidebar idea. Also, w hile you're here, maybe also make the triangle filter toggleable? As it makes no sense with categories sidebar placed on the right side. But probably it makes sense to be proposed as another patch in case this one will be accepted.
> maybe also make the triangle filter toggleable? As it makes no sense with categories sidebar placed on the right side. It can be reoriented such that it makes sense on either side, and the approach I'm using to put the sidebar on the right takes advantage of that.
(In reply to Forest from comment #29) > > maybe also make the triangle filter toggleable? As it makes no sense with categories sidebar placed on the right side. > > It can be reoriented such that it makes sense on either side, and the > approach I'm using to put the sidebar on the right takes advantage of that. I'm not sure if it makes sense, as this filter (per my understanding) was added specifically to handle mouse movement from bottom left corner to the top right corner. In case of alternative sidebar placement it probably would only cause confusion (emotionally descibed by the previous commenter :) ). I personally against any such sort of mouse filter, as it's directly against any principles of good UX. When user moves cursor over button, they expect it to respond by highlight effect, and/or get activated on left click. User may not know about this whole filter thing and how it works, ending up in situation when their mouse movement got filtered out — and they just sit there frustrated, because the button doesn't respond to mouse movement and clicks, with no visible indication of reason (such as "disabled" greyed out state). Imagine being a first-time user of KDE Plasma and seeing this ("Linus test", if you wish) — the first impression would be that the thing is broken and buggy, that's all... But anyway, all what I'm suggesting is just an option in settings. I'm totally okay with "left sidebar + triangle filter" behavior enabled by default — as long as there's easely discoverable option to change both. But even just an option for right sidebar placement will already make me much happier.
(In reply to Forest from comment #29) > > maybe also make the triangle filter toggleable? As it makes no sense with categories sidebar placed on the right side. > > It can be reoriented such that it makes sense on either side, and the > approach I'm using to put the sidebar on the right takes advantage of that. There needs to be a way to disable it completely. When it exists in any form, it affects the mouse cursor hovering over it. Case in point: Even with your modified patch (to switch the default view), the "Triangle Filter" still interferes with my usage of the categories that are now on the right side. ("Am I moving my mouse too straight? At an angle? Wiggling it ?") The "Triangle Filter" only exists to solve a problem that this new launcher introduced. And now it becomes a new problem in of itself. So if your patch gets accepted (which I hope it does!), there needs to be a way to easily disable the "Triangle Filter".
Created attachment 161269 [details] draft: Kickoff sidebar automatically on the right (Plasma 5.27) I have been working with Nate (KDE developer) to get this into a state that he's happy with For Plasma 6. The current iteration drops the config option and puts the sidebar on the right by default, unless Kickoff is in a panel on the right edge of the screen. (The config option might return, depending on how the discussion goes.) For testing purposes, here's another draft for Plasma 5. It doesn't remove the triangle filter (that would probably have to be a separate change) but I find that the triangle filter is much better behaved in this repositioned layout, so this might have the nice side effect of also helping people who dislike the filter.
Strangely, a few people have given my merge request a thumbs-down, with no valid criticism beyond having to adapt their muscle memory to a positioning change. It seems those people think a one-time inconvenience to them outweighs the unending frustration to others that is caused by the current layout. If you want to see this fixed, I suppose it might help to add a thumbs-up vote on the the merge request's top level comment/description. Here's the link: https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-desktop/-/merge_requests/1628 If you join the discussion there, please keep comments constructive, of course.
(In reply to Forest from comment #33) > Strangely, a few people have given my merge request a thumbs-down, with no > valid criticism beyond having to adapt their muscle memory to a positioning > change. It seems those people think a one-time inconvenience to them > outweighs the unending frustration to others that is caused by the current > layout. > > If you want to see this fixed, I suppose it might help to add a thumbs-up > vote on the the merge request's top level comment/description. Here's the > link: > > https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-desktop/-/merge_requests/1628 > > If you join the discussion there, please keep comments constructive, of > course. "Your account has been blocked. Please contact your GitLab administrator if you think this is an error." Not sure why. I can login to my KDE Identity account. But trying to use it to access the GitLab gives me the above error message.
(In reply to Forest from comment #33) > it might help to add a thumbs-up vote on the the merge request's top level comment/description Thanks for sharing, I upvoted. People who thumbed down probably are not satisfied for the same reason this bug report was created — not having an option toggle in settings. I believe that adding an option is the only way to make everyone happy.
>"Your account has been blocked. Please contact your GitLab administrator if you >think this is an error." > >Not sure why. I can login to my KDE Identity account. I suspect the bug tracker doesn't use the KDE identity server. (At least, I didn't notice a request to identity.kde.org when I logged in.) If that's true, I think you would have to create a new account.
Er, I mean the Gitlab instance.
(In reply to Forest from comment #36) > If that's true, I think you would have to create a new account. I have a working KDE Identity account. When I click to register a new account (for their KDE Invent GitLab), it takes me to the KDE Identity page... of which I'm already logged in with my active account. Trying to login to KDE Invent, regardless, gives me the error message: "Your account has been blocked. Please contact your GitLab administrator if you think this is an error." I have a separate GitLab account, with the same email, that works for gitlab.com. I can even login to KDE Identity with no problems. So this appears to be specific to "KDE Invent". :/
I sent a request over Phabricator. Hopefully it gets resolved. I'll vote for your merge request as soon as I am able to login again. :)
Max wrote: > People who thumbed down probably are not satisfied for the same reason this bug report was created — not having an option toggle in settings. Good point. I had updated the title to "place sidebar on the right in most cases", to reflect the config option's removal as requested by Nate. It's possible that those drive-by downvotes were reactions to the lack of choice. I wish they had used words to express themselves instead of mysteriously dumping on my work as a whole. > I believe that adding an option is the only way to make everyone happy. It is starting to look that way, isn't it? Nate already rejected that idea from me twice, so I'm not going to push him on it, but Noah (another KDE developer) recently chimed in agreeing with you. Perhaps adding your voice in support of it over there would help show that a user-facing option really is appropriate here?
*** Bug 441746 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
*** Bug 435630 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
*** Bug 438234 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Git commit af2df3c153f227332172d0e87fe98a0637d41a04 by Nate Graham, on behalf of Forest ix. Committed on 12/09/2023 at 21:26. Pushed by ngraham into branch 'master'. Kickoff: add option to move sidebar to the right side of the popup Always placing the category sidebar on the left made it an obstacle to reaching the favorites when Kickoff was located at the left edge of the screen. The direct path to select an item from the Favorites list required the user to move the mouse across the sidebar area, and if the journey across sidebar items took longer than half a second or curved/veered in a way that the triangle filter doesn't expect, it would be interpreted as a hovering sidebar selection, removing the favorites from view and disorienting the user. Since humans don't always move mice in quick, perfectly linear motions, this frustrated more than a few people rather often. It was especially problematic when Kickoff was at the bottom left corner of the screen, because the sidebar's Favorites category item (which is always at the top of the list) was then as far away from the mouse as possible, adding insult to injury by making it extra inconvenient to find and click whenever the user had to restore the favorites to view. Then, after restoring the favorites to view, the original experience could easily repeat as the user once again moved the mouse from the sidebar's Favorites category item, across the sidebar, toward their target in the Favorites list. Solution: This patch adds a config option to place the sidebar on the right, so people can have their favorites near the mouse when it opens. Layout mirroring is respected, so Tab key navigation should work just as well in locales with right-to-left Tab key navigation as it does with left-to-right. FIXED-IN: 6.0 M +4 -0 applets/kickoff/package/contents/config/main.xml M +28 -10 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/BasePage.qml M +27 -0 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/ConfigGeneral.qml M +18 -29 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/Footer.qml M +7 -2 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/FullRepresentation.qml M +44 -37 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/Header.qml M +10 -0 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/Kickoff.qml M +2 -2 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/KickoffGridView.qml M +10 -4 applets/kickoff/package/contents/ui/LeaveButtons.qml https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-desktop/-/commit/af2df3c153f227332172d0e87fe98a0637d41a04
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh yeah baby!!!!! =) =) =) Very awesome. Very. Awesome.
Created attachment 161592 [details] Kickoff with switchable sidebar position (Plasma 5.27 version) My solution has been merged into Plasma 6. (Thanks, all!) Here's a Plasma 5.27 version for those who don't want to wait.
(In reply to Forest from comment #46) > Created attachment 161592 [details] > Kickoff with switchable sidebar position (Plasma 5.27 version) > > My solution has been merged into Plasma 6. (Thanks, all!) > Here's a Plasma 5.27 version for those who don't want to wait. That's awesome! Thanks a lot for your dedication and patience. I'm really happy to see this merged in master.