Bug 80981

> and Konqueror doesn't quit, but merely closes the window.

What additionally to closing window should it do? Stop the process? Do you have preloading enabled?

IMHO, it should quit the entire program (close all windows and stop the process) when I click "Quit".

The point is that a more natural choice of text for that button would be "Close window" instead of "Quit".

And yes, I have preloading enabled.

Stephan, mind that I have more than one window open.

Ok. You confused me by making it sound being related to tabs, you could have also written the report about two windows and Location/Quit menu entry. Btw, I just notice that KMail (with open composer window) behaves the same.

Where exactly did _I_ confuse you "by making it sound being related to tabs"?

Besides, it _is_ related to tabs, as Konqueror doesn't ask if you haven't got more than one tab open.

Good point about the Location->Quit menu entry, I had not thought of that.

By describing the testcase with tabs.

But my testcase doesn't work without using tabs!

The relevant parts of our style guide:

http://developer.kde.org/documentation/standards/kde/style/basics/terminology.html
http://developer.kde.org/documentation/standards/kde/style/basics/quitclose.html

If you want them to be changed I suggest you to discuss this on the kde-usability mailing list.

Alexander,

you seem to feel that pressing 'quit' is about an application; this is incorrect since KDE uses an approuch of one window-per-document.  There is no direct mapping of window to application, only of window to document.
This gets a little strange with konqueror; certainly with the introduction of tabs, I agree.
But since all KDE applications use this mapping (quit is for a document, not an application) it would be foolish to use something different for konqueror.

Remember that 
a) different konquerors can be spread accross different virual desktops; its not visible what will happen if you 'quit' all instances.
b) different konqueorors can have different processes; making it hard to implement.
c) different konquerors can have things like KWord embedded; what does quit then do? Quit all konquerors, all KWords ?

I hope you agree with me that all KDE applications should behave the same, if you do; then these are also relevant:
d) A KDE application can have several windows open which represent one document. Pressing quit closes all those windows. Calling it 'close' would not do it justice.
e) An MDI (multiple-document-interface) application like kate can have more then one document in one window; close would be confusing if it would close the  window.

In short; you are right that the naming of the dialog you mentioned is a little confusing at first; but like all things a new application takes a little time to learn, after which it is predictable since its consistant with everything in KDE.

As a closing note; you expected that more happened automatically then actually happened; pressing quit a couple of more times is all you needed to do. Imagine someone thinking the opposite of you; she expected one 1 window to close, when 10 closed. This means she would loose a lot of work.
I certainly think the current situation is preferrable for both people.

We already had this discussion on the kde-usability mailing list over a year ago. The main issue with "Quit" is that it is a technical term, and its usual definition is not even consistent with its usage not only within Konqueror but within all of KDE (wherever no true SDI is used). As I put it in the discussion back then:

"So as conclusion: KApplication::quit() is practically deprecated since it 
should be up to the user when all windows are closed (i.e. only when he 
actually closes them all manually).
(...)
So the Close and Quit problem boils down to a linguistic problem: A clueless 
user who uses KDE for the first time but used other systems before will 
relate Close to "close the window" and Quit to "quit the program". This is 
not the case in KDE though, so I suggest replacing "Close" and "Quit" with 
short descriptions of their actual purpose, e.g. "Close" = "Close Document" 
and "Quit" = "Close Window"."

http://lists.kde.org/?l=kde-usability&m=104585784716200
Asking the same question as back then: is there a problem with that solution?

Just wanted to file a report about this (i.e. f.e. child window with multiple asks if i want to 'quit' it on ALTF4)..
Datschge, i fully support your proposal.
Should i open a new report about the renaming of that button? 'Quit' is really misleading, especially for computer-savy people... It should only come up if the window is the last one of that process imho, and then it should be called 'Quit application'.

The previous UI standards specified a close-the-window meaning for quit. At any rate, an action that closes a /process/ would be pretty much useless since the mapping between windows and processes is not at all transparent.

Ok sorry if i didn't make myself clear: i did not support the initial cause of the bug but Datschge's proposal in #10: rename the button from 'Quit' to 'Close window' instead of making quit really exit the process (that'd be useless indeed *g)

Stephan, I view this as a bug in Konqueror, regardless of discussion going on on mailinglists and regardless of what the guidelines are. I don't think I should have to point out the reasons for a bug to exist in order to be able to point out the bug itself. If that's how this system works, there are plenty of bugs that should be marked as invalid that currently are not.

Thomas, when you say "you seem to feel that pressing 'quit' is about an application; this is incorrect since KDE uses an approuch of one window-per-document", I want to point out that KDE does not hold the definition of what is correct or not. I view the act of judging my opinion as merely a feeling, but your opinion as what's "correct" to be highly arrogant.

When it comes to expectations, I expect Konqueror to first and foremost behave like a web browser when it is in "web browsing mode", not first and foremost as any other KDE applications, as the uses are different. I believe this is my view, the view of most people and also what would be best for Konqueror. Firefox and Opera are good examples of how the "Quit" and "Close" functions in
browsers should behave.

I still think buttons should describe what they actually does and stand 100% behind what I first wrote in this bug-report. If it's marked as invalid, it's your loss and I won't persue the issue further.

Created attachment 29710 [details]
Add new standard gui items 'Close window' and 'Close document'

Here's a patch implementing two new actions for applications to choose from, providing a more specific description of the requested close action (either for current window or document).

Created attachment 29711 [details]
New icon for the new 'Close document' action

Created attachment 29712 [details]
Patch of konqueror to change the close action to 'Close window'

Depending on the patch to kdelibs, this makes the button description more precisely describe what it actually does. Also, the icon displayed is now the same as in the context menu's close action.

Created attachment 29716 [details]
Add new standard gui items 'Close window' and 'Close document'

(this time WITH the header change)

re: the patches --- it may be best to send them to a mailing list like kde-core-devel, since they're very UIish, and so outside the scope of normal konq-bugs readership.

Maksim i sent it to the core-dev list and no one voiced any objections, i guess that means this could get committed?

*Hallo* fellow konqueror developers.. anyone alive?

Sorry, I wasn't cc'ed on this one so I didn't see the followups. I'll have a look now.

SVN commit 922351 by dfaure:

CloseWindow and CloseDocument standard gui items (for buttons, like in bug 80981). Will be in 4.3.
CCBUG: 80981


 M  +16 -0     kstandardguiitem.cpp  
 M  +16 -4     kstandardguiitem.h  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=922351

I'll commit the konq patch and close this on Monday, can't use new kdelibs API before.

SVN commit 923940 by dfaure:

Use KStandardGuiItem::closeWindow in the messagebox
BUG: 80981


 M  +1 -1      konqmainwindow.cpp  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=923940