Bug 192425

Right. i have same problem here.

Displaying empty stars if item is not rate sound like the simplest issue.

Gilles Caulier

I will make interface terribly cluttered...

I would suggest different solution (very similar to Adobe Bridge):

White rectangle with small arrow. When arrow clicked show menu with color labels (yaaay ;) - after choosing label rectangle changes color. But when hovering over this rectangle show stars.

Five empty stars below each photo will look bad (IMO).

Mik,

Do you have screenshots from Adobe Bridge ?

Gilles

Sounds good to me, Mikolaj, as long as the rectangle is always visible
(i.e., it does not default to a white rectangle on a white background
with no outline). My problem is that I find it hard to know where not
to click.

Damo.

Some (tiny) screenshots here:

 http://books.google.ie/books?id=E3Urw48Oz74C&pg=PA56&lpg=PA56&dq=adobe+bridge+stars+%22color+code%22&source=bl&ots=waTHcnWSiZ&sig=Asfa0zomLCKpLmK1oF8UYmVODhk&hl=en&ei=2oYKSs2VNJWD-AaB--3YCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=16#PPA56,M1

Sorry, that was all I could find.

Someone else had a problem with accidentally hitting hotkeys and
changing the ratings in Photoshop:

  http://forums.adobe.com/thread/358670

They asked for a "safety lock" for the ratings. Perhaps that is all
that digiKam needs: a toggle button on the tool-bar to set whether
clicking below the thumbnails affects the star ratings or not. That
would probably be trivial to implement and would solve my problem.
I like the ratings and the way they work, I just keep clicking on
them by accident and wasting time correcting my mistakes.

Colour-coding would be a nice extra.

Sorry, Gilles, "memoria fragilis est" - I mixed two interfaces - Adobe Bridge and FotoStation (with small bits of IMatch). But both are interesting and with taking elements from both of them we can agree on good mechanism.

1. Adobe Bridge. There is empty space below image like in digiKam in this space after selection of image, dots will appear which can be selected and become stars. You can also choose labels from main menu (not mini-menu I previously described) and those color will appear as visible in DGardner links or your own from other bug report:  http://digikam3rdparty.free.fr/OthersSoftware/Bridge/adobebridge-colorlabeltags.jpg
(on your screenshot there are no stars but they would  be overlayed over color labels)
2. FotoStation: After hovering ca. 250ms over image plate small widget will appear in lower part of image. It will containg X and 5 dots. Rating is assigned after clicking dots, X removes rating. If you select images quickly, before special area is activated image is selected - even if this is area of rating - rating isn't assigned. Color labels are assigned through mini-menu on bottom of image plate and this mini-menu is used only for color labels. IMatch has similar mini-menu but it is practically full context menu (terribly long).

My suggestion is similar Adobe Bridge:
Don't show area or anything by default. All special actions are shown only after selection of image. In this way first click will only select image (or when clicked in image perform preview/edit action) and shows all additional widgets. Maybe even show those additional elements only on one image where mouse is?

What about (additionally) a "fast rating mode", enabled by menu, where rating stars are outlined as shadows and rating widget is shown on entering with the mouse, but all that only temporarily for fast rating of many pictures?

Marcel,

First i would to solve this issue for 1.0

About your proposal, it sound a little bit complicated to do, and require important changes. 

This is my proposal : Using QTimeLine with RatingBox, to display progressively rating stars over item, using alpha blending with background, like selection or rotation icons are displayed.

The goal is to force user to stay over RatingBox before to be able to rate item really. A delay between 500-800 ms can be enough. no more. During this delay, RatingBox is displayed progressively to be more visible step by step. User can only rate when widget is fully visible.

What do you think about ?

Gilles Caulier

SVN commit 976791 by cgilles:

remove RatingBox widget. Use RatingWidget instead everywhere.
RatingWidget has now a fading mode to display progressively widget 
This mode is used in new icon-view based on Model View to switch is edit mode when 
user move mouse over the widget.
During fading, widget appear and rating cannot be edited. fading duration is 1500ms. 
This will prevent unwanted rating assignation to item when user move mouse over the item to
just only select it.
To really want to change rating to item, user need to stay over rating widget more than 
fading duration.
This patch only change this behavour in iconview, not with thummbar. Thumbbar is not yet 
ported to Model/View, but when it will done, we will use same component than iconview and 
problem will be fixed automatically there.
BUG: 192425


 M  +0 -1      CMakeLists.txt  
 M  +7 -6      digikam/albumiconviewfilter.cpp  
 M  +18 -17    digikam/iconview.cpp  
 M  +26 -24    digikam/imagepreviewbar.cpp  
 M  +10 -6     digikam/imageratingoverlay.cpp  
 M  +3 -2      digikam/imageratingoverlay.h  
 D             digikam/ratingbox.cpp  
 D             digikam/ratingbox.h  
 M  +174 -65   digikam/ratingwidget.cpp  
 M  +14 -0     digikam/ratingwidget.h  
 M  +1 -0      libs/imageproperties/imagedescedittab.cpp  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=976791

I agree that fading in the rating box like the other buttons is better than the current solution.

Notwithstanding, with the number of overlays that we have or plan: Selection, Rotation, Rating, color tags, maybe comment editing in the future - I can imagine that some users will feel this is overloaded and want to switch off some of these. This could be done by simple actions in the View menu.

For me the fading is much too long now. Also the widget is invisible when no rating has been done. Sure it was like this before, but at least you could have find it more easily by accident in the past, when you were hovering over the item.
Now it doesn't appear for a long time, and you need to really know where the widget should be.
I can only speak for myself, but right now it is so slow that I rather use the keyboard shortcuts :)

Delays in KDE (and MS-Windows) interface are usually 500ms. I think this is enough to make quick selection and move further but not so long that use will get bored ;)

I see also when hovering 6 outline stars. It is reduced to five after adding rating.

Created attachment 34208 [details]
six stars in album gui

>For me the fading is much too long now. Also the widget is invisible when no
>rating has been done. Sure it was like this before, but at least you could have
>find it more easily by accident in the past, when you were hovering over the
>item.
>Now it doesn't appear for a long time, and you need to really know where the
>widget should be.
>I can only speak for myself, but right now it is so slow that I rather use the
>keyboard shortcuts :)

Look in d private container :

http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/extragear/graphics/digikam/digikam/ratingwidget.cpp?revision=976791&view=markup

duration = 1500;   // ms

change the value and try again...

>Delays in KDE (and MS-Windows) interface are usually 500ms. I think this is
>enough to make quick selection and move further but not so long that use will
>get bored ;)

600ms to be precise :

http://lxr.kde.org/source/extragear/graphics/digikam/libs/widgets/common/itemviewhoverbutton.cpp#57

... this is for the select button over icon view item.

Gilles Caulier

6 stars ???

this screenshot is taken during rate edition. right ?

Originaly, image do not have rating. right ?

Gilles

Changed for 500ms and it is much more acceptable.

But it is hard to hit area when stars will be activated. Shouldn't be better if *all* overlay elements would be visible after hovering over plate (with some delay of course)?

@16 - Gilles

Yes, originally this image didn't have rating. When I assign stars I will se only 5 stars (with some outlined). Even after removal of rating for this image next time I will be presented only with five outlined stars.

ok, with unrated picture, i can reproduce here. investiguation under progress

Gilles

SVN commit 976887 by cgilles:

if image is unrated, draw star properly (not 6 stars)
set fading duration to 600ms
CCBUGS: 192425


 M  +5 -5      ratingwidget.cpp  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=976887

Marcel, 

More reflexions about this entry:

- The problem is to be able to identify where is the rating widget over item.
- It's especially true if item as no rating assigned.
- Until now, rating widget appear only when user move mouse over it.
- It must be more easy, and more homogeneous with selection/rotate buttons to display rating widget when user move mouse everywhere over item.

What do you think about ?

Gilles Caulier

Maybe we could display the rating widget semi-transparent all the time?
Selected stars will be full color of course, and when you hover over, the widget becomes fully opaque.

Andi

Showing always overlay such complicated elements as 5 stars will create visual noise - especially when browsing with minimum size of thumbnail.

I would suggest solution from IMatch always show some widget in simple form - bar, oval after *left* clicking on it menu will appear with choices about rating / labeling. It *will* create visual noise but IMO smaller than 5 stars.

Also this would allow for removing rating/labeling options from main context menu making it smaller.

>Showing always overlay such complicated elements as 5 stars will create visual
>noise - especially when browsing with minimum size of thumbnail.

agree, to have already tested this solution. Icon view is bloated...

Gilles

Created attachment 34239 [details]
too big spaces

IconView is already bloated, or better say has too much spaces.
Look at the screenshot. I normally don't care about creation time etc, I usually only display the filename.
But there is too much space between the filename and the actual icon.
I think most user will always display the filename, but not the other stuff. Maybe we should put the filename on top and the stars somewhere else?

SVN commit 977032 by cgilles:

Display rating widget when mouse is over icon view item. By this way:
- user can always see where he can click to change rating, especially with unrated item.
- behavour is the same than select/rotate buttons over icon view item. It's homogeneous.

With previous behavour, rating widget been displayed only when mouse is over rating widget area.
User need to discover this feature by searching area. Now, it's more intuitive.
CCBUGS: 192425



 M  +1 -1      imageratingoverlay.cpp  
 M  +18 -5     ratingwidget.cpp  
 M  +5 -2      ratingwidget.h  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=977032

Marcel, Andi, Mik,

Now it's more clear with my last commit. Try and look like it's more intuitive to use rating widget over icon view item.

I think we don't need a settings somewhere to enable/disable rating edit mode over icon view...

Gilles Caulier

Created attachment 34243 [details]
bug rating widget

There is a bug, a rating widget appears at the wrong place in thumbnail bar.

Julien

@27 - Gilles - for me it is near perfect. There is awkward moment when moving over plate where rating exists they vanish and animation starts from blank state. It would be better with fluent animation between existing state and "edit mode".

@25 - Andi - between filename and icon is rating and - hopefully - labeling area. If this feature is turned on in configuration it should be visible. But maybe whole plate could accommodate to configuration? For example when rating/labeling is turned off - collapse plate few pixels, the same for areas where dates are usually showed, tags, etc.

To Julien #28,

Yes, i can reproduce it. It just a side effect, i don't know yet why. Just move mouse over item and effect will disapear. It sound lie something is not initialized properlly. investigaution under progress...

Gilles

SVN commit 977278 by cgilles:

hide rating widget at thumbbar init.
CCBUGS: 192425


 M  +1 -0      imagepreviewbar.cpp  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=977278

To Julien #28 : It must be fixed now. please try again...

Gilles Caulier

Marcel,

I think we can close definitively this file now. fine for you ?

Gilles

Fine for me

I had a chance to try out the changes on 1.0.0-beta5 (in Kubuntu 9.10).
It is definitely better than before--in some respects--a quick click on
an image does not change the rating (usually). However, once the stars
are shown, I don't like the following behaviour:

 1. If I click to the right of the stars, but not on them, it assigns
    a 5-star rating. I don't understand this. I did not click on the
    stars, so why is it changing the rating? If I want to assign a
    5-star I should have to click on the fifth star.

 2. If I click to the left of the stars, but not on them or not too
    close to them, it removes the rating. OK, this is one click less
    than having to click on the first star twice, but I keep doing
    this by accident. When I am not trying to remove or change the
    rating (as in 1.) it is very annoying.

 3. If I click to the left of the stars, not on them, but within
    about about one star-width of the first star, a 1-star rating is
    assigned. So, if I click to the left, I either rate it zero or
    one stars depending on the proximity, but, either way, it is
    usually an accident.

 4. After changing the rating, I have to mouse-out and mouse-in to
    the thumbnail panel before I can change the rating again. This is
    annoying if I change it by accident or change it to the wrong value.
    It is also inconsistent with the behaviour in the thumb-bar when
    previewing an image.

On balance, I'd rate this as two steps forward and two steps back. As
the original reporter, I'd really like to see this bug re-opened for
the continuing usability problems to be addressed.

re-opened...

Sorry for harping on, but I have two more usability issues that I'd
like to report:

 5. When I mouse-over a thumbnail to set the rating and click on
    the wrong star (as I do), say the third one, the five stars
    shown in outline collapse to three stars and are re-centred
    in the thumbnail panel. If I want to correct my mistake and
    set the rating to two stars, my first instinct is to click on
    the second star, but, as described in 4. in my previous comment,
    I have to mouse-out-and-in to make the rating editable again.
    However, my second instinct is to mouse-out-and-in and return
    the mouse pointer to the position of the second star, but this
    star now moves to the left because I'm back to the 5-star edit
    mode, which re-centres the stars. The same problem occurs if
    I just see a rating that I want to change: I move the mouse
    pointer to the stars and the stars move left as I enter the
    thumbnail panel, so I have to move the mouse again. I think
    this "moving target" is a usability problem.

 6. When the stars are shown in the thumb-bar on the preview page,
    they can be hard to read, but if a contrasting colour were
    used to outline the stars (just like any mouse pointer since
    the 1970's), they would be easier to see. (Maybe I should open
    a different bug report for this.)

No change in RC1.

I have just tested the current version from svn, and I agree
with the issues raised by DGardner in #35 and #37.
Especially by 1. and 2. I managed to accidentally change previously assigned
ratings! So this is in my opinion an important issue.

Personally, I would even prefer a configuration option, so that a change
of ratings via the mouse can be disabled (also this fading in/out looks nice,
especially at the beginning, but is already too much eye-candy for my taste).

digiKam is under string freeze. Add this option will add a new string.

If kde translator mailing list is ok, we can do it before 1.0.0 final.

There is a volunteer to implement this option. It's easy to do.

Gilles Caulier

If there were an option to turn off setting ratings with the
mouse, I probably would not turn it off; I like the ability
to use the mouse. My original problem was that I did not know
where I could click safely and that is still a problem, though
the "danger area" has moved around a bit.

Using 1.0.0 yesterday, I tagged a bunch of images and was
doing lots of selections in the icon view. When selecting a
range of images to which to apply the same tag, I selected
the first image and then Shift-clicked the last image. However,
if that Shift-click was over the star-rating area, the images
were not selected; the first image remained selected and the
"current" image was set to the last image (or whatever that
outline highlight means).

The "star-rating area" seems to take up the whole width of the
little icon frame, even though the stars are only a small part
of that. Because none of the images were rated, I did not have
any visual cue to tell me exactly what area to avoid. Therefore,
nothing has really improved since I opened this case: it is still
a nuisance.

Add to that a whole load of accidental ratings because of the
issue with clicking to the right of the stars granting them
a 5 and crashes every ten minutes when applying tags and I
have to say I just gave up and got drunk. The only mitigating
factor was that no image had been rated, so it was easy to spot
when I was accidentally changing the ratings, often it is not
as easy to spot these slips or to fix them.

I've also changed my mind: if you add an option to turn off
ratings with the mouse (in Settings or via some toggle button
on the tool-bar), I'll take it gladly. The current system is
just too annoying and I find I really only rate things when
looking at them in full-screen mode anyway (the icons are too
small to make any judgements about the star-rating). I also
use the Ctrl+1-5 shortcut keys now instead of the mouse.

The new images have yet to be rated, but hopefully 1.1.0 will
mean that I won't have to keep starting digiKam over-and-over
after crashes if I change any more tags.

Did you provide backtraces for the crashes in another bug report? Otherwise this would help us, too.

*** Bug 226751 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Moving "star Ratings'" position to the top of the thumbnail will avoid clicking over it by mistake while Ctrl+Clicking multiple images.At present they are almost at center of thumbnail (if showing file name,size,dimensions,tags,captions etc are ticked in the album view) and one clicks generally at the center.

Very long discussion, old bug report, many different aspects, sometimes unspecific general criticism. If any wishes remain for digikam 2.0, open dedicated bug reports.