| Summary: | fonts look blurry in kword 2.0 beta 7at 100% | ||
|---|---|---|---|
| Product: | [Unmaintained] kword | Reporter: | Mohd Asif Ali Rizwaan <maarizwan> |
| Component: | flake-texttool | Assignee: | Thomas Zander <zander> |
| Status: | RESOLVED UPSTREAM | ||
| Severity: | normal | CC: | apfelmausmail, cornelis, domlyons, hcoohb, kneczaj, leusmag, loonyphoenix, mutlu_inek |
| Priority: | LO | ||
| Version: | 1.9.8 | ||
| Target Milestone: | --- | ||
| Platform: | unspecified | ||
| OS: | Linux | ||
| Latest Commit: | Version Fixed In: | ||
| Sentry Crash Report: | |||
| Attachments: |
kword and kate together with same font look ugly in kword. please see at 100% zoom (actual size)
ugly fonts at 200% |
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Description
Mohd Asif Ali Rizwaan
2009-03-08 07:38:42 UTC
Created attachment 31891 [details]
kword and kate together with same font look ugly in kword. please see at 100% zoom (actual size)
Note that KWord is a WYSIWYG application. This means that 100% zoom makes the paper size (A4) be exactly the size that A4 is supposed to be on your screen. Which practically speaking means it will always be zoomed slightly, unless you have an exactly 72 DPI X server. You can verify that with starting KWord with the argument --dpi 72,72 So, while applications like kwrite are optimized for screen display, KWord is optimized for showing exactly the same on screen than on paper. And, yes, the fonts suffer from this due to the DPI of our screens being too low. The only solution to this is to special case 100% somehow, but we tried that in KWord1.x and this resulted in much bigger problems. I just wanted to add that users and distros might want to play with the hinting and the subpixel antialiasing settings of their kde install. Turning off subpixel AA is something that will make things less blurry (in line with what people got on Windows). All these settings can be changed in the kde4 systemsettings module for fonts/appearance. *** Bug 195080 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** *** Bug 195126 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** Openoffice and Ms Word can render sharp fonts at any zoom, so why kword cannot even using 100%? Created attachment 34534 [details]
ugly fonts at 200%
I don't think, that leaving this as WONTFIX is a good idea. Especially with small fonts kword becomes almost unusable. Have a look at the screenshot. In OpenOffice Writer everything looks fine.
I understand that there is a problem with matching the different resolutions. However, while KWord aspires to be WYSIWYG, it can be confirmed quite easily that it does in fact NOT display on screen as it will print... thus it does not look like on paper, where small font sizes do not appear bold. WYSIWYG means exactly that it SHOULD display exactly as it will print. WYSIWYG is an acronym for What You See Is What You Get. OpenOffice and MS Word are WYSIWYG examples of text editors and they render much more sharper fonts, which are better to read in any zoom, in any resotion and dpi. Fonts look definitively ugly in KWord 2. Unusable for me. WYSIWYG or not, it has first to be readable to be usable. Only want to report that those ugly bold fuzzy fonts are a show stopper for me as well. I've removed Koffice2 and won't be reinstalling until the fonts are fixed. I realize the bug report is resolved as won't fix, but I won't give up hope, either. To clarify: what does mean "Resolution: WONTFIX " ? Does it mean wontfix for Koffice 2, and wait for Koffice 3 ? If so, is there any plan for Koffice 3 ? I've tried the 72 dpi and fonts at 100% looks much better, but it doesn't change the fact that scalled fonts are ugly. Scalled fonts in for example openoffice looks perfect, so it's possible. Anyway, Koffice 2 should be more considered as a beta version of Koffice 3. @L_V_ please don't make statements that spread FUD, you are not helping the devs feel more responsible by doing this :( Notice, guys, that this bugreport talks about *bold* and *blurry* fonts. Nothing else. Keep your issues separated as the mishinted fonts is a different issue and likely upstream somewhere. I agree that L_V's comments are very silly at best. I think KOffice is becoming a really nice office suite and if its potential is realized, KWord will clearly become my main word processor. However, Thomas, this bug is not only about bold and blurry fonts, but rather about altogether *broken* fonts as shown for example in the attachment to comment #7: http://bugsfiles.kde.org/attachment.cgi?id=34534 Turning off subpixel rendering, which you mentioned, makes fonts look slightly better, but some fonts are still a real pain to look at. I also tested running KWord when forcing the app to 72 dpi and it does indeed look much better. Thomas, what do you suggest users and distributions to do? Should we change the kword.desktop file and change the command to "kword --dpi 72,72"? I did it for now, but it does not seem to be a very elegant solution... Any information as to how this will be resolved or how users and distributions should deal with painful font rendering would be highly appreciated. As all your hard work are, too! @Thomas Zander You are not helping the devs feel more responsible by thinking that closing a bug before resolution is the best way to solve it. You just postpone the problem. If for any good reasons I don't know, it has been decided to not fix this obvious problem, without any explanation, the only valid extrapolation is to interpret that it is posponed for Koffice 3. Disappointing from user point of view, but simple logic. This is all so off-topic, but... @ L_V: Thomas _is_ the dev. And yes, your attitude is annoying and counterproductive. Disagreement over whether something is a bug happens from time to time on bugtrackers. Bugs marked as "wontfix" can nonetheless be discussed, if users feel a strong necessity to do so. But this needs to remain civil and reasonable. Quite obviously, Thomas has software-architectural reasons for rejecting this bug and we are not fully aware of them. He provided a few hints as to why KWord is at least party not responsible and a few tips as to what we can try. If you are interested in KWord's betterment, you should try to understand what Thomas wrote, try his suggestions and report back in a way that helps all of us. Convincing a developer who sees no (remediable) flaw in his work cannot be achieved by denigrating him or his product. If you are not willing to do this, please do not hinder development on bugs.kde.org, or, for that matter, anywhere. This is all so off-topic, but... What is hindering the development is the attitude to close bugs either before any explanation or solution. This so obvious and visible problem should had been seen many months ago. If a developer cannot see it, just ask a real user, he will tell immediately the problem, and why he will not use Koffice 2, not because he doesn't want, but cannot. " ... why KWord is at least party not responsible" : nobody cares at user side in which module is the problem. The problem has to be solved wherever it is, before releasing Koffice 2. And finally, it is more constructive to "hinder" the development by alerting before spreading Koffice 2, than hiding the dust under the carpet. -- end of remark -- For devs: If the bug isn't in koffice but in some library (maybe freetype2), which koffice uses please report it there. We as common users really don't know where is the source of the bug so we cannot even try to communicate with people responsible for the rendering. For people who wants this issue to be solved: please vote on the bug! maybe this encourage developers to fix it. Now there is only 50 votes which means that few people wants this bug to be fixed. *** This bug has been confirmed by popular vote. *** Dear Thomas, and KOffice devs, Brother, Sorry to bug you with the bug. But the visual aspect of koffice/kword is really stopping the users from using it. I'm not trying to force you to do the fixing, nor contriving you to fix it. Just humble urging, that the fonts' appearance is stopping/pushing the users away from koffice. Which is couterproductive for koffice, as the users are the main "users" of the application! Don't you think: 1. A doctor should not treat the patient unless a "Real and Complete" cure is discovered? shouldn't the doctor try alleviating the suffering of the patient? Shouldn't koffice be a good software to look at? Can't we not use the same 1.x patch for displaying text, and have "true printing" mode for this current behavior? How can we expect users to work with software when it hurts the eyes!? It's ok for the dumb people who can't differentiate purple from blue, orange from yellow; but for the people with awareness. this will hurt. Let's compare the interfaces of Dictionaries (window and text appearance): Beautiful and worth using (for me): Lingoes Dictionary: http://www.easyfreeware.com/images/screenshots/lingoes_education_mathematics-4884-screenshot.png Rather Average looks (bear with it, if no alternative): Babylon Dictionary: http://www.softpedia.com/screenshots/Babylon-Pro_1.png UGLY, Not neat/beautiful (but no choice have to use in linux): Stardict: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/65/Stardict-screen.png Golden Dict: http://goldendict.berlios.de/screenshots/bab-compare.png MDictionary: http://mdic.sourceforge.net/images/mdic_shot.png Btw, if all of the above were opensource, and free, which one would you choose (if you needed a dictionary interface)? Appearance does matter. That's why we dress up nicely everyday! And that is why We smile :-). thanks. Thanks for your 'humble urging'. I'm not sure how I can help, it still is an upstream bug. so can you report it upstream and past the link? This bug is very important for kword, but no one will fix the "upstream bug" if it isn't reported upstream. You as a developer should now where is the bug. I definitely agree with revious posts, this bug is a real show-stopper and I think koffice cannot pretend to egals other Office pack quality with such a bug not resolved... And this is ashame ! Related feature request: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=237305 *** Bug 239882 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** Just a small comment, I agree with the rest of the guys. This bug is supposed to be resolved, but it is not. Kword still has those fonts which are kind of blurry for the users. I really would like to fix this problem. I believe on Koffice. I know that there are other office softwares out there, but What kind we all do to fix the problem? It would be nice if at least some of us can pay the developers to do the fixing. I do not have much, but since I believe in Koffice maybe we can all pinch a little. Since there are a lot of people that want this bug to be fixed, we could all pinch a little like 3 to 5 dollars or something like that. Is there a way to do this? If not how can we get the message to the developers that can make a difference on how the font looks, to fix this problem once and for all? Thank you. pookito @josh or pookito: please read the link given in comment #27. It is being worked on in Qt. Although the bug is "resolved" I want to point on http://community.kde.org/Calligra/Meetings/Mid_2010_meeting/Minutes#Font_rendering |
