Bug 117649 - open letter to KDE developers
Summary: open letter to KDE developers
Status: RESOLVED INTENTIONAL
Alias: None
Product: kde
Classification: I don't know
Component: general (show other bugs)
Version: unspecified
Platform: unspecified Linux
: NOR normal
Target Milestone: ---
Assignee: Stephan Kulow
URL:
Keywords:
: 117986 (view as bug list)
Depends on:
Blocks:
 
Reported: 2005-12-04 12:34 UTC by J.Bakshi
Modified: 2005-12-20 16:35 UTC (History)
0 users

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Description J.Bakshi 2005-12-04 12:34:13 UTC
Version:           unknown (using KDE 3.3.2,  (3.1))
Compiler:          gcc version 3.3.5 (Debian 1:3.3.5-6)
OS:                Linux (i686) release 2.6.8-2-k7

Dear KDE developers,

I may draw your attention that I have been using KDE and KDE related S/W since 
KDE1.x :-)  Those days were really Golden days for us who used KDE. I could 
use even KDE 2.x with as low as 32MB RAM and PI 266MHz processor. The speed 
was just so Great that window users with more Superior H/W couldn't compete 
with my system and I was always ready to bet anything for KDE.

Now a days I have AMD 1.8GHz CPU with 128MB 333MHz RAM and KDE 3.3.x. I have 
noticed that KDE is gradually going to be a monster in the sense that it 
needs more RAM more CPU Speed and ULTRA MODERN H/W which are out of the reach 
of maximum of Linux community. I can Bet for this point. Even my system with 
not so old H/W, works much much slower with KDE3.3.x (than KDE 2.X with PI and 
32MB).  I have seen a lot of end-users to go for KDE but at the same time I 
have also seen just more and more Linux users/KDE LOVERs leaving KDE as they 
can't upgrade their H/W  so frequently to satisfy KDE.

I , on behalf of the whole Linux community and LINUX Desktop users; REQUEST 
all of you, the KDE developers, that KINDLY give us back that SPEEDY and THIN 
KDE technology which once made all others desktops facing Shame in-respect of 
Speed and in-respect of low H/W requirement and in-respect of eye candy. 

KDE has also become very much intregrated with its application. ( what is the 
use of KDED Password Module, KDE print deamon, KDE-LIRC deamon; when we can 
do all these perfectly well with other speedy tool ? ), hence it has lost the 
modularity concept of Linux and so much closer to the Microsoft windows 
desktop. Naturally it eats more resources. 

Definitely if you like KDE being popular among the end-users we shall always 
be happy by heart. But KINDLY don't block the in-dependency of us to filter 
out all those which are actually *unwanted* to us. Default KDE installation 
needs HUGEeeeeee packages as dependency and most of the packages are required 
for games, education and for those tools which are actually required to 
support the integrated parts have been introduced tightly in KDE for 
end-users. We have NO WAY to Bypass all these WNWANTED STUFFS.
Please CC to me to share your thoughts.

with regards,
J. Bakshi
member of Indian Linux User Group
member of Linux Gadget, member of LIRC
member of XFCE, member of FOX -tool
Comment 1 Stephan Kulow 2005-12-04 13:20:15 UTC
KDE1 lived in a world where there was no antialiased fonts, no css2, no XML in whatsoever config files, etc. You have to accept the world changes, and so does software. And KDE developers _do_ care for speed, but at the same time we try to please people that do not want xfce (those have xfce), but something with more feature. And where compromises have to be made, we will continue making them as we see them fit. 

BTW: what would interest me: how many fonts do you have installed? Many asian users report KDE is too slow and then I find them installing > 1000 fonts.
Comment 2 J.Bakshi 2005-12-08 12:14:15 UTC
On Sunday 04 Dec 2005 5:50 pm, Stephan Kulow wrote:
[bugs.kde.org quoted mail]
I am not orthodox and No problem at all to add features. but I am asking for 
kindly make an arrangement so that people who are not beginners and know 
linux; they can bypass all the huge dependency or all those unwanted parts 
which is required for newbiers only. Like lirc server in KDE  is not required 
for those who are using lirc since long without any KDE supports and they are 
happy with their native modular configuration rather than  KDE-lirc 
integration in KDE. I just request to focus here that huge integration is 
really not required or if the integration is there at-least make an 
arrangement so that we can bypass these section. Again KDE-education section 
is not required for most of the users ; still it comes to satisfy the KDE 
dependency during installation. I hope you the KDE developers kindly think on 
these points.  ***MODULARITY***.    I LOVE to see KDE coming back to the 
number 1 position again in 
the Desktop technologies. So a re-engineering is required which makes KDE run 
well with old H/W too; just like GNOME. 
> BTW: what would interest me: how many fonts do you have installed? Many
> asian users report KDE is too slow and then I find them installing > 1000
> fonts.

here is my font section of XF86Config-4

Section "Files"
        FontPath        "unix/:7110"                    # local font server
        # if the local font server has problems, we can fall back on these
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/misc"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/cyrillic"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/100dpi/:unscaled"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/75dpi/:unscaled"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/Type1"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/CID"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/Speedo"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/100dpi"
        FontPath        "/usr/lib/X11/fonts/75dpi"
EndSection

I have not installed any extra fonts but only the default in debian 
installation (sarge)
Comment 3 Rex Dieter 2005-12-09 16:02:38 UTC
*** Bug 117986 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 4 Anirban Biswas 2005-12-16 21:52:12 UTC
Hi J. Bakshi 

    The modularity of KDE generally do not depends too much on KDE developer but on the Distors which pack them in rpms or debs. So for Fredora kdebase rpm may be huge and may contains unnecessary modules you do not need. Why do not you just downlaod the source set the ./configure parameter with you need and compile and install only those components you need. (You are a Linux power user so you know how to do that).

    Else you can try Gentoo and emrge kde. You will get kde with only the compnents you just need and it run good on a old h/w like a pentiun 4 1.8 Again I turn all the eye candy on in KDE for that machine. I use Baghira as my  style . color and window decoration. Tangarin as my icons set , full translucency on KDE menu and the task bar. I run my machine in 1024 X 786 res. The speed is really good

   Now if you compare the current KDE 3.4 or 3.5 with Windows XP then you are  comparing a Desktop which is almost 3 years old and was ment for to run on Pentium 2 and 3 with 32 MB RAM. Now the latest KDE 3.5 is just 1 to 2 months old and ment for latest h/w so if you want to run the latest KDE you need atest hardware and it is true for any s/w

  As the time passes the softwre become feature rich and runs good on the latest hardware.

  So if you need speed why do not just you load a old distro like Red Hat 7.3 and update the kernel and X. Since you have no complain to use KDE 2.x I think you will be happy with it.

  And in the last the what you logged in this bug list is not at all a bug. You may say that you want a feature  that is KDE should be lean and mean and can run on old h/w

Anirban Biswas.
   
Comment 5 Clay Barnes 2005-12-19 03:04:16 UTC
Just a technical point:  Windows XP *requires* 128MB RAM and recommends 256 (not 32), and I would *never* run it on under 512 for anything heavier than solitare (Also, the system was designed to run on a P3 at *least*, and I'd not skip a P4/AthlonXP for it, either).

As for making it light...  I agree with you.  Gentoo or a raw ./configure; make; make install (both with a half page of use flage) is the only way to lighten up a system much that has a desktop environment.

Note that if someone is looking for very light/fast, a full desktop envionment is the wrong idea.  Look to a light and fast Window Manager (the *box's are good, as is e16, and it has lots of _tasteful_ eyecandy).

--Clay Barnes
Comment 6 J.Bakshi 2005-12-20 16:35:30 UTC
On Monday 19 Dec 2005 7:34 am, Clay Barnes wrote:
> As for making it light...  I agree with you.  Gentoo or a raw ./configure;
> make; make install (both with a half page of use flage) is the only way to
> lighten up a system much that has a desktop environment.
>
> Note that if someone is looking for very light/fast, a full desktop
> envionment is the wrong idea.  Look to a light and fast Window Manager (the
> *box's are good, as is e16, and it has lots of _tasteful_ eyecandy).
>

Thanks for sharing your idea. I have found a Good and Super Fast window 
manager called icewm and managed to design a GOOD and FAST Desktop based on 
it and idesk. But I'll love to see my old friend KDE working with Old H/W 
too. I belief good binaries can make it possible. 
> --Clay Barnes